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I donāt want to yuck anyoneās yum, as the review scores keep improving so obviously folks are liking it, but youāre not alone if it still doesnāt click. They keep polishing it and piling on more stuff, but the base game is still rather disjointed and in my opinion, easy to burn out on. Procedural generation doesnāt mean any of the procedurally generated things are going to be interesting.
Yep, I had my fun on it, but without true PVE itās just another exploration/building game.
You mean PVP? Itās got Playter vs Environment in spades.
No PvE. This being a coop game, itās missing real challenge for pve.
Did you forget that single-player and perma-death are things?
That said, the real problem with what youāre looking for vs this game is down to the premise: Interstellar travel without tech that feels like cheeting isnāt a pew pew space-ship game. Generation-or-cryosleep-ship-simulator-gone-wrong isnāt out ā¦ yet.
Huh? No, Iām literally talking about coop PvE. It would be nice to have a challenge when I am in space or when Iām trying to build a base.
It just sounds like you donāt like single player games.
Lol. What? I like single-player games, but I mostly agree with this person. Most of the challenging games are SP (primarily) all the souls/souls likes are SP. Not liking NMS is not even close to being the same as not liking SP games. People are allowed to not like NMS. Itās boring and grindy and it (to me) never feels like youāre progressing in any meaningful way.
If you like it, thatās fine. It doesnāt mean anyone who doesnāt doesnāt like SP games.
Yeah, imagine wanting to play games with people you actually know in meatspace. You might even have to touch grass. Horrid thought.
A punishment isnāt the same as challenge.
For example: The souls games have very little punishment (especially compared to their contemporaries when the older games released, where you load a save on death). You die and collect a thing you picked up in that period, nothing lost. Theyāre very challenging though. Ramping up punishment is a form of challenge, but permadeath doesnāt make it more fun, just adds a big punishment to worry about. That can be good, but NMSās combat is not good, compared to other games that do the same things.
This isnāt to say it should do things differently. Thereās plenty of reasons for it to remain as bland as it is, because it makes it approachable and it also easily functions with the proc-gen terrain. This is only a statement on what it is, not the quality of it.
Which is? Admittedly Iāve only played the game for a couple of hours, but I remember there being PvE, so youāre going to have to be more specific into what is it that you think is missing.
It has no real pve. Itās got a few things that might attack you on a planet or the pirates in space. But there is no real danger in the game. There arenāt factions on planets trying to kill you or systems controlled by groups that require a lot of work to clear out. Planets feel lifeless and space feels like a walk in the parkā¦ add in 2 friends or more and itās a joke.
By that definition Minecraft also doesnāt have PvE. Factions are not required for a PvE, and lots of PvE games donāt have them.
You could say that you wanted the PvE to be harder, or more unforgiven, or even more complex with factions. But to say the game has no PvE is just wrong.
Minecraft has no real PvE. Itās literally not billed as a pve game, pve on Minecraft is a side thought. My example with factions is just that an example, itās not to say that the game lacks pve because it doesnāt have them. I donāt care how hello would implement more pve but I just want more of a challenge. NMS has no real challenge because it lacks real pve.
True, i put something between 100 - 200 hours into it and while they repeatedly add āspecial stuffā i cant really motivate myself to go back, exploring feels boring after some time and the pve is ok but not good enough to be a motivation in it self, but to be fair im also not the collector type of guy and there may be a dedicated fanbase who enjoys this.
On the other hand not every game has to life for ever and if the average player has 50-100 hour of fun and than never again touches the game than that is also totally fine.
Yeah seriously, no matter how much they tack on, it still doesnāt make the base game fun to play. Nothing more boring than a game that feels like a job.
I love Factorio, and many other games some call ājob simulators.ā Done well, games can feel like jobs and be good. The difference is when it feels grindy, or if it feels like youāre doing novel things and actually accomishing things. NMS just feels grindy, and like youāre doing the same thing over-and-over, without any reason to continue.
I confess I havenāt popped back in for a few updates now but it still was missing the slick/dynamic animal behaviour that even the very first trailers had, which I was most interested in.
I like to pop in every time they drop an expedition. Those let you speedrun the game and get reacquainted with it with not much effort. You also get introduced to whatever new thing they added. Itās a bit like playing ARK on a 20x resources 20x taming server so you can just play the game without so much grind.
It seems like the kind of game that sort of requires a lot of time to make it really click, but I wasnāt having fun within the first 2 hours, so it got refunded.
I had a blast starting out and discovering new materials and what I could do with them, upgrading my ship and guns, building bases, etc. I hit a wall when I unlocked most of what I wanted and was just logging on every few hours to check my settlement and send my fleet out. The quests are repetitive, exploring planets isnāt really exciting, and the combat system is honestly not great. Thereās like 2 viable weapon attachments and the only hostile things are critters and robots, the latter of which are basically the cops so the more you kill the more come to kick your ass so you either have to fight wave after wave or run for your life.
Oh and the planetary vehicles are pretty cool but I think you have to have them on your capital ship to use them elsewhere, but I donāt have the upgraded drive to be able to actually take it to the places I would really like to have them. So I just move my ship around the surface instead, and that takes fuel just to launch it which is a hassle.
Well thatās good, I was just getting close to running out of the old planets.
Kind of wild they keep going.
if all it takes to keep a developer improving their game is to hype it to the moon and then turn it into a meme when it releases then maybe we should do that more often /s
forreal forreal though these game devs are the shit and Iām grateful for all the work they keep putting into this
All it takes is people with a vision.
And a willingness to lie out your ass and fraudulently market for years
I thought we Internet rabble had decreed āno mans sky is good nowā. Am i behind the times? Do i need go find my pitchfork?
Iām in the minority that doesnāt support fraud š¤·āāļø I donāt care how much time and effort they put into the game after stealing millions of dollars
I respect that.
To be fair, I think most of the more recent changes are just backporting engine upgrades and stuff from the new game theyāre working in. Thatās still a lot more effort than just saying that, but itās not like theyāre developing explicitly for NMS anymore.
It also letās them test the upgrades in a real environment before the new game launches, preventing another mess at launch. Itās a smart use of resources, keeping people discussing how well you maintain the old game going into the new game. Itās free press, along with probably more sales.
Thanks for explaining this! :)
When they say ātrillions of new planetsā they mean one new biome with the plants and rocks in a trillion different places.
I wonder how many trillions of floors Diablo 1 had if they had used this weird way of marketing No Manās Sky uses.
Isnāt the gameās universe randomly generated and had nearly infinite worlds since launch? š¤Ø
Yeah, thereās still quadrillions of planets unexplored. This is just icing on the cake I guess?
āwe added more shit nobody will ever see!ā
I mean yeah but itās still cool
It adds more complexity and distinction between planets, at least.
Close, proceduraly generated so psuedo-randomly to ensure that no planets are exactly alike. If you spend enough time in game it does begin to feel a bit like more of the same. Within 24 hours of this update I had already found a few things I had never seen anything similar to in the game.
Were they interesting? Or at least enough of a change to make them significant? Or are we talking random rock model here?
I found a planet where half the aliens had a star on their belly and they excluded the other aliens from all the activities so the two groups were locked in a bitter eternal civil war.
Why is trillions in quotes? Did they add them or not?
I write a planet generator. All of the planets are the same to begin with, so realistically I can only generate ā1ā planet. Then I add one toggle which is random, if itās on the planet will be completely water. I now have ā2ā planets. Now I add another toggle for one huge mountain, I can now generate ā4ā planets (dry,water,dry-mountain,water-mountain). Keep adding toggles, sliders and parameters until you have ātrillionsā of possible planets and youāre done.
The funny thing is that the changes are cumulative, so if I release a game that can generate X planets and I add a binary toggle I can now claim I added X planets to the game. If I add a slider from 0-9 then I added 10X planets. So since No Manās Sky already had a giant number of planets, adding trillions of them could mean something as stupid as they added a new resource to the game so now every planet can have that resource in different amounts.
I thought Iād check which 2^N gets you to a trillion, itās N=40. So you can have 40 parameters per planet and add one more, then suddenly youāve created an extra trillion planets.
And thatās assuming just toggles, if each parameter has 10 levels you only need 12, then add one toggle and you get trillions. Heck, I can name 12 parameters that have at least 10 different values off the top of my head:
- Amount of water overall (oceans and lakes)
- Amount of mountains
- Amount of Forrest on the land
- Amount of life forms
- Temperature
- Amount of moons/rings
- Size
- Amount of rivers
- Whether the landmass is one big continent or multiple small islands
- Amount of volcanoes
- Amount of caves
- Amount of iron (or any other resource)
Congrats, if you now add a does the planet rotate toggle youāve created trillions of planets.
Itās a procedurally generated universe(s). These systems havenāt all been pre-generated, but will rather be generated to explore when a player visits a system for the first time.
Right, but that still counts. Although I guess itās kind of an āif a tree falls in the forestā question. If the world doesnāt exist unless you find it, was it really there before?
The point is rather how meaningful this statement is. It doesnāt really matter if your algorithm can come up with trillions of ways to place trees, if itās the same handful of trees itās still gonna feel samey after the third time.
Hmm, true
Just more procedurally generated and boring as fuck ānew planetsā
To be fair, what this really means is that it adds more options for proc-gen. This means planets will be more diverse, which is good. The actual number of them is totally pointless, but itās easier to report in than the tangible effect.
Iād trade that update for one that fixed the jank combat. I will continue to complain about the gun being auto-holstered after 2 seconds without firing as one of the worst parts of combat, so āline your shotā is a terrible strategy because by the time itās lined, youāll miss due to the animation creating a 1s lag between click and shot.
The almost random targeting of what youāll interact with when holding E is another big annoyance.
Capital ships are a total letdown, too. All they do is sit around motionless in space. Canāt destroy anything bigger than a fighter.
Hey, at least they added inventory sorting!
You know, after a decade of people asking for it. And without fixing the several fundamental design flaws that made the inventory a nightmare to use without sorting in the first place.
But at least they thinly papered over one of the gameās most hated bits!
Can anyone recommend a decent space sim? Iāve talked myself in and out of buying No Manās Sky a dozen times, and all this shade will probably remove it from my wishlist.
Depends on what you want out of the game. Freelancer is old, but itās still one of the best experiences you can get. If you really want to feel like a nobody pilot going from rags to riches, X4 or Elite: Dangerous can scratch itch, but both have considerable learning curves, with X4 allowing you to own space stations and pilot anything from fighters to frigates.
I put so much time into Freelancer. The multiplayer was really fun if you had a friend to fly with.
Rebel Galaxy feels a lot like it, but itās focused on capital(ish) ship combat (broadsides, etc) instead of fighters.
I need to get back on Rebel Galaxy, I think I got some 2 or 3 missions past reuniting with your aunt. The sound track is fucking amazing, though the gameplay being essentially naval battles in space really let me down at first, as I personally prefer 6 degrees of freedom, but the game does all things well.
Yeah, the soundtrack is perfect for the vibe the game is going for.
Where can you get Freelancer these daysā¦?
Only in yo ho ho seas š“āā ļø
Itās annoying that it isnāt at least on GOG, itās such a prime candidate.
True. Itās been number one requested game, but its copyright hell is among EA and Microsoft :(
Thereās a lot of different types of space sims. What kind of gameplay are you looking for?
I fucking love No Manās Sky. I play video games to relax. Most of the time I ignore objectives and find my own way around. I used to follow people and creatures around Skyrim. I had been playing a ton of Red Dead Redemption 2 just to go ride hourses and look at stuff. My friend Trudi had me play 20 minutes or so on her computer and I bought my copy that day. I have been playing it off and on for a few years now.
Just play NMS. Get it on sale if the price is a concern. Itās neat.
Not really a sim, but def a fan of space games. Void Crew has been great.
Iām enjoying x4. I also liked Elite Dangerous but that one was more limited in what you could do. They have added more in the years since Iāve played it though
Depending on what you want, Freespace 2 and all its mods/updates are still excellent. Wing Commander Saga is a standalone game based on it of remarkable quality.
I wouldnāt base your decision on what Lemmy says. Theyāre pretty unreasonably salty about the game. Reviews from players are very positive and the gameās only $23 right now.
- Despite what theyāre saying, there is actually a lot of legitimately interesting and sometimes fantastical biomes and this update has added even more.
- There are a lot of different parts of the game that you can pretty casually engage in. Various missions, settlements, settlement management, ship collecting, manufacturing, fleet management, trading, piracy, archeology, and more.
- Itās a relaxation game for me. Just hop on, pick a direction, and go. Do whatever piques your interest in the moment.
If ācasualā and ārelaxingā are dirty words for you, then it probably isnāt up your alley. Itās certainly not going to be intense and action packed (though it does have its moments). But itās a good game if you, like me, sometimes get tired of the sweaty online shit, crunchy brain melting games, and the overall weight of life in the real.
NMS is ok. I play it from time-to-time, and probably have 10s of hours in it. In survival mode, it feels similar to subnautica; or I guess most survival games (I personally havenāt played many). The breadth of mechanics is huge, but they all lack depth. Combat on ground and in space is very simplistic, for instance. Space combat is just pressing a button to have your ship auto-lock on a target, pressing another button to switch between anti-shield and anti-hull weapons, then pressing the shoot button. I really donāt like the cartoonish aesthetics of the other sentient alien races, or my character.
I used to really like the Freespace and Wing Commander games when I was a kid; and havenāt really played anything comparable (i.e. high production value with good stories and voice actors).
Iāve played X4, just for maybe an hour or so, and it seems like itās another sandbox-like game.
Honestly I think it is time they put NMS to bed and focus on their upcoming title, LNF.
They have added so much over the years, and I understand as their first project they are probably incredibly attached to it, but lately it has been feeling like diminishing returns on updates.
What good are a bunch of new planets gonna do when they still all basically look and interact the same as every other planet?
They have added new planet types and civilisations. Indont play the game but its being heavily praised all day that theybhave greatly expanded with gas giants, full water planets and lost/failed civilisations. Sounds fairly impactful.
I do play the game and I can say from experience it isnāt.
Recalling when two people found the same planet and did not see each other, disproving any implied multiplayer -
Whatās the birthday paradox look like for ātrillions?ā
Iāve played with two of my children at the same time. During the Utopia expedition, we saw dozens of other players. Where have you been?
Did you know the word ārecallā refers to events that happened in the past, when things were different?
Youāre referring to something from the initial release. Which isnāt relevant anymore.
Thatās like complaining that Bethesda hasnāt released the Creatorās Kit for Skyrim (since it was a legitimate complaint at one time) and expecting it to be a solid addition to the conversation.
Donāt be a dick just because youāre a decade out of the loop.
Youāre referring to something from the initial release.
Yes, I am. Why can you only interpret that as a complaint about right now?
When someone goes āhey, rememberāā that doesnāt mean theyāre unaware of anything thatās happened since.
I had a stray thought about mathematics and a silly moment from a decade ago. Yāall are being dicks by reading that as impossible ignorance. Like I just woke up from a coma and this was the most pressing thing to comment on.
Iām just returning the attitude youāre giving others.
If you donāt enjoy how it makes you feel, maybe work on how you talk to people.
Cause all you got handed to you was the same energy you were throwing out.
Right, sorry, I shouldnāt have started calling people names. No wait that was you.
I shouldāve taken a jovial attitude to a bizarre accusation. Oh wait I did.
I shouldnāt have picked a fight with anyone to begin with, hey wait, I didnāt.
What youāre doing is projecting the shittiest possible reading of literally two sentences and assuming that must be exactly how I meant it. Youāve barged into someone elseās misunderstanding and made it a personal argument. No amount of politely picking that apart - for example - by agreeing, and asking why referring to the past must be a complaint about the present - will dissuade you from this course.
If you donāt think thatās a case, tell me how else I could have phrased anything, to avoid this abuse.
Thanks for the essay Iām not gonna read
I still want my money back. Iāve tried all their updates and the game still feels bleh, underwhelming and just overall boring
I can only speak for myself but I didnāt like it because it felt like the same experience over and over. I admit I havenāt played since launch, but back then, i quickly realized all the planets had the same minerals. They had different randomized animals and colourās but they were generally just the same. And then I lost interest, because I was hoping to be able to find rare minerals, unique items, stuff that wouldnāt exist in other parts of the universe, and perhaps he able to trade it with other players or npcs.
I guess I wanted a different game than what the makers wanted.
Looking at the video now, it still looks like the same basic experience with improved graphics.
I think of it like an oil slick on a pool of water. Very pretty, but absolutely zero depth. They indulge heavily in the aesthetic of a space sim, without actually having anything of substance tying it all together into something coherent.
Yeah, they overpromised and then didnāt deliver on half of what they claimed. That they are applauded now for doing some of what they said theyād do is laughable to me.
