Since the 2 comments here have negative votes, I’ll go ahead and say: Good! You need some radical shit happening USA, and AOC is a good start.
Way too early. The person who is in the lead as a normal primary begins, is NEVER the final nominee.
Uh, Joe Biden was in the lead from the start.
So, trump will win again…
Nah, if Donnie gets to run for a third term, so does Barrack.
Most of our fellow Americans are massively misogynistic and its been highlighted twice in the last 10 years by the fact that Trump won the presidential election against women. I’m saying this as a massive fan of AOC. I identify pretty strongly with her open aggression towards backwards thinking.
I think it’s more along the lines of Hillary and Kamala were just too meh of a candidate to actually get people out to vote. I think AOC even though generally not as big tent as the previous two will still perform really well because of the amount of billing willing to go out and vote for her.
I disagree, I think Hillary and Kamala were bad candidates and covering it up with blaming it on misogyny is actively harmful.
Hillary and Kamala were bad candidates. I didn’t cover that up because I agree. They were the equivalent of a hangover fart in a sauna far as presidential nominations go, but I disagree that their loss wasn’t spurred at least partially by a growing amount of misogyny in society.
“Growing amount of misogyny” compared to what time exactly?
Hilary and Kamala were dogshit candidates.
Hard agree.
Factually incorrect, as evidenced by the fact that Hillary won the popular vote.
The problem isn’t running women. It’s running women who are unscrupulous and/or shitty at politics. Harris couldn’t even make it out of Iowa in 2016, so it was evidently a stupid call to let our brain-damaged former president anoint her as a successor without a primary.
Beware of ANYONE going around spouting the “we can’t run AOC because WOMEN ALWAYS LOSE! Just look at the LAST TWO TIMES!” bullshit
As if Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris were perfect candidates offering anything more than “imagine how bad Trump would be!”
“The Most Lethal Millitary”
“Nothing will fundamentally change”
“Pokemon Go!-to-the-polls”
I mean come the fuck on.
“Pokemon Go to the polls” was just a silly meme. I think voters wanted somebody to the left of Obama, and Hillary felt like a big step back to the '90s.
Dissing Bernie’s platform didn’t help. One key moment I remember was her saying that Medicare For All was something that would “never, ever happen”. Instead of adapting her platform to win over Bernie’s voters, she just dismissed it completely as foolish pipe dreams. Just really tone deaf and smug about it.
Agreed. It’s like people think these candidates were above reproach despite the very obvious flaws.
George W Bush once said that if the popular vote mattered he’d campaign in Texas.
No shit it doesn’t matter, but it does demonstrate a flaw in LDF’s point.
Not really. That’s kind of the point of the quote. If the popular vote actually counted it would radically change the way elections are run and campaigned in. There’s no telling how that election would change if the popular vote mattered.
That election is pretty interesting for instance because Hillary made massive mistakes in not campaigning in certain swing States. Or at least campaigning enough. Michigan being the main one. Now maybe that means in a universe in which popular votes mattered she would win. Or maybe it means in a universe where popular votes matter, Trump would campaign in places that he didn’t before and get a lot more votes. The entire concept is altered dramatically by that key fact.
Either way the point is you can’t just assume it would be the same because clearly it would not.
Thank you for sharing your opinion. Have a nice evening.
Aight. Cool. Wanna bet democracy on it?
Always with the platitudes.
You were fine with democracy being flushed down a toilet when Hillary was rigging primaries against Bernie or when Dems sue Greens off the ballot at the state level.
Was I? Cause I’m pretty sure I strongly campaigned for Bernie during the primaries even after Super Tuesday when the race pretty much ended. My voting didnt take place until the 15th and I still put his name on my ballot. Then when the presidential election rolled around I voted for Bernie again as a write-in.
You can try to put me into some nice little predefined box, but I’ve its not going to prove your point. My point is simple. If we for some reason need to run against Trump again in 2028 do you feel confident beyond doubt that swing state voters are going to support AOC or any other female candidate? Cause in case you haven’t learned this yet, unless you live in Florida, Georgia, Iowa, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania or Michigan…our votes don’t really matter. And quite a few of those states are pretty rural.
I mean you also see conservatives vote for people like Boebert and MTG. Misogynists, surprisingly, will reliably prioritize their other ideals over whether to put a woman in power.
If we for some reason need to run against Trump again in 2028 do you feel confident beyond doubt that swing state voters are going to support AOC or any other female candidate?
Women won senate races in three of the swing states Kamala lost, so clearly gender wasn’t the problem.
I am confident beyond a reasonable doubt that AOC would beat Trump, if only because Trump would be an incredibly weak candidate. I’d love for him to try.
I’m also confident that the Democrats are at risk of losing an entire generation (both in the short and long terms) the longer they keep offering uninspiring candidates and refusing to give any policy concessions to the left, especially those popular with young voters.
Confidently incorrect. Popular vote doesn’t win elections and red state men don’t vote for women.
I say this as a huge fan of AOC, I think she should be Veep and have the POTUS leave at the start of the second admin. Then let her run once (twice?) more.
Explain your prediction?
Maybe they could make a system where people can vote for who they think would be a good candidate for the party, and then the party members can agree to vote for that candidate
No woman has won a presidential race in the United States.
The two women who made credible attempts at becoming president also happened to be utterly terrible politicians, but I’m sure that had nothing to do with the outcome.
Okay, so question: Why, in two out of the last three election cycles, has the DNC put forward “utterly terrible politicians” as the party leader and candidate for the world’s highest office?
Because a non-terrible candidate would do popular things they don’t want to do? What even is this question?
So either AOC is a terrible politician or the DNC won’t push her.
I mean it’s fucking obviously the latter? What’s even your point here?
The DNC likely won’t push her, they’ll push Newsom or Harris (she’s already mentioned she’s thinking about running again)
Because if they can’t win with their corpo zombie zionist center-right candidate, they’d rather lose and play feckless controlled “opposition” than do anything to jeopardize their gravy train with a progressive.
Uh huh. Keep going.
Granted, not many have made it to the general election as the candidate of a party with a chance.
Both that have lost to Donald Trump.
Probably better than Greasy Gavin, but still voted in favor of Israel IIRC.
Oh fuck off, this is how you get Trump 2.0
Trump probably lost both the primary in 2016 and general elections both times, but we will never know for sure because most of the vote counts were not counted by humans in easy to understand ways.
Real democracies have ways to count ballots everyone is ok with, recounts are allowed. Witnesses standing in for each candidate see the counting take place and can ask for a do over.
Here, in the USA, many people see such things as quant and old fashioned; most votes are counted in literally mysterious ways; by things run by oligarchs or the very people invested in winning. And recounts are often not allowed. And often when recounts are done it’s just asking the above companies if things are ok.
Things are not ok as shown by United Nations tests to detect mass fraud, and exit polls as well as polling data before elections.
But anyone trying to have a discussion about this is automatically not part of mainstream politics. I remember huge tech conventions about this subject I am talking about ; but all were soundly ignored by all parties and mainstream media.
In fact, the price of participation in mainstream politics in real life or social media, is turning a blind eye to all this.
And that is how you get a Trump. Followed by lame controlled opposition, followed by another Trump.
I think most Americans do not understand democracy is both voting and making sure that vote is accurately counted. In some states it is.
But honestly, I don’t think Americans as a people can do democracy.
LOL
How quickly people on this thread forget that the American people are sick and tired of funding the genocide while they themselves can’t afford a trip to the grocery store, and maybe it’s an issue Dems should take into consideration since it (arguably) sunk the Harris campaign.
No clue why you’re gettimg downvoted. Sometimes it feels like Lemmy exists in this weird quasi liberal bubble where they think leftist=tankie. Like do the people replyimg to go not understand that the DNC has a record low approval rating as well?
There are a lot of Reddit libs migrating here as that platform enshittifies who haven’t had their awakening yet. They still think they’re left and progressive, or - perhaps more accurately - that the DNC is the progressive, left-leaning choice; when in reality it’s at best a center-right party with an increasing number of obvious incidents of being controlled opposition when it comes to a number of issues (including and especially Israel)
Yeah like whoopsie we almost stopped Trump from spending literally all the money on bombing Iran for basically no fucking reason, but ONE Democrat broke ranks AGAIN guys? Oh, John Fetterman? Again? Oh jeez, well we tried guys, it just wasn’t in the cards. Maybe if you vote Blue no matter who even harder next time we can write a sternly-worded-enough bill to condemn these actions!
Anyway I’m ranting but they need to make that journey. It’s not enough and it never will be, the DNC. The best for now is to use it as a launching platform for actual progressives and leftists.
sick and tired of funding the genocide
#bothSides
And it begins again
Yeah but apparently she later changed her stance. I don’t remember the details but it’s quite recent.
I hadn’t heard that. Will need to read up on it.
Last I read she was doing the whole bullshit “I support defensive weapons” nonsense that Dems started pushing when it became clear that people were pissed about the genocide and AIPAC.
